***Possible Spoilers*** Roland opened the door at the top....

[Robert Gray]

My one thing with the ending was as to why Roland was being punished. The two turning points in which Roland chose to sacrifice things were Jake back at the caves, and Susan in Mejis. He chose the tower over these two individuals on two separate occasions, but the reincarnations don't give him a second chance at Susan. It only gives him a second chance at Jake..., but later on in the series, he already does get a second chance at Jake, so why send him back in time?

Roland didn't sacrifice Susan. He did not make a choice knowing she would be doomed. He believed her safe and sound, having taken several measures to ensure she was out of harm's way. He chose to sacrifice Jake, however, and that is why he was repeating that trip. It doesn't matter that fate allowed him to reconcile with himself over the betrayal (and with Jake). At that moment he did not stand and be true. The Tower is not sending Roland back to redeem himself. You are putting too much weight on Roland. Roland is a man of destiny to serve Gan's will and until he gets it right, the cycle will repeat.

[costanza]

The Wind Through The Keyhole could be a tale about a different reincarnation of Roland; the final one.

I was hoping so too but it looks like it involves Roland and Cuthbert tracking down a Werewolf. From the front page of the main website:

not directly about Roland Deschain, but yes, he and his friend Cuthbert are in it, hunting a skin-man, which are what werewolves are called in that lost kingdom


Skin-man reminds me of Blade Runner. lol

[LadyHitchhiker]

I absolutely hated and detested and felt betrayed when I read the last page of the book.

But now I've come to terms with it and it's grown on me

[boogerb53]

There was no other possible ending. The book wrote itself, ka is a wheel. yada, yada, yada......It is what it is.....the Alpha and the Omega.

[FakeJake93]

Roland didn't sacrifice Susan. He did not make a choice knowing she would be doomed. He believed her safe and sound, having taken several measures to ensure she was out of harm's way. He chose to sacrifice Jake, however, and that is why he was repeating that trip. It doesn't matter that fate allowed him to reconcile with himself over the betrayal (and with Jake). At that moment he did not stand and be true. The Tower is not sending Roland back to redeem himself. You are putting too much weight on Roland. Roland is a man of destiny to serve Gan's will and until he gets it right, the cycle will repeat.

Well, he chose leaving for the tower over living a peaceful life with Susan, inevitably leading to her death.

So the Dark Tower is sending Roland back in time over and over again to get that one moment right? If what you say is true, than the weight is on Roland's shoulders to follow out Gan's will. What I am trying to get at is that it required him letting Jake fall down the cliff in order for him to learn to love Jake unconditionally later on. Without that mistake to learn from, how can he possibly change his ways when his memories are erased?

One could argue that human nature or the horn would cause him to do it differently, but isn't accepting Jake's love later on enough? Why that one crucial moment?

I was hoping so too but it looks like it involves Roland and Cuthbert tracking down a Werewolf. From the front page of the main website:

not directly about Roland Deschain, but yes, he and his friend Cuthbert are in it, hunting a skin-man, which are what werewolves are called in that lost kingdom

How could that take place in between Wizard and Glass and Wolves of the Calla, though? Perhaps The Wind Through the Keyhole and this are two separate books, since Cuthburt was long dead before the Gunslinger.

[Robert Gray]

Well, he chose leaving for the tower over living a peaceful life with Susan, inevitably leading to her death.

No. The Tower wasn't even on Roland's radar when he knew Susan. What books did you read? Susan was dead in the fire long before Roland ever began his quest for the Tower.

So the Dark Tower is sending Roland back in time over and over again to get that one moment right? If what you say is true, than the weight is on Roland's shoulders to follow out Gan's will. What I am trying to get at is that it required him letting Jake fall down the cliff in order for him to learn to love Jake unconditionally later on. Without that mistake to learn from, how can he possibly change his ways when his memories are erased?

No. It didn't require that at all. He loved Jake even before he let him fall and hence the damnation. Roland judges himself. He knew it was the wrong thing even as he did it, after the fact, and forward in time. Whether or not Roland always goes back to that same moment is not something we can prove one way or the other. I can't speculate on stories not yet written, only on what was clear in the text. As to learning from mistakes, that is irrelevant. Roland didn't need to learn it was wrong. He knew before he did it.

One could argue that human nature or the horn would cause him to do it differently, but isn't accepting Jake's love later on enough? Why that one crucial moment?

That is a question best put to Gan and not me. The next best person to ask is Roland himself. Even later when Jake is rescued, Roland still knows he is damned. He has no illusions. Perhaps Gan doesn't judge Roland any harsher than Roland does himself.

[FakeJake93]

No. The Tower wasn't even on Roland's radar when he knew Susan. What books did you read? Susan was dead in the fire long before Roland ever began his quest for the Tower.

There was something in the text that something along the lines of: "And then Roland has his choice, a nice quiet life with Susan or his path as a gunslinger". Whether it was the Dark Tower or not, he had some sort o decision.

No. It didn't require that at all. He loved Jake even before he let him fall and hence the damnation. Roland judges himself. He knew it was the wrong thing even as he did it, after the fact, and forward in time. Whether or not Roland always goes back to that same moment is not something we can prove one way or the other. I can't speculate on stories not yet written, only on what was clear in the text. As to learning from mistakes, that is irrelevant. Roland didn't need to learn it was wrong. He knew before he did it.

So, if Roland knew it was wrong, and doesn't need to learn from his mistakes... why does the Tower send him back? I speculated that it was sending him back to achieve his salvation through learning from mistakes and doing things differently since he now had the horn. Granted his memory is erased when he goes back, but what other point to it could there be? (unless Gan is just having fun messing with Roland, laughing at him everytime he gets to the top and putting his reaction on OlympusTube)

That is a question best put to Gan and not me. The next best person to ask is Roland himself. Even later when Jake is rescued, Roland still knows he is damned. He has no illusions. Perhaps Gan doesn't judge Roland any harsher than Roland does himself.

Obviously Gan knows what is going on, if not Roland, but that was the point of ending the series as he did, was it not? To drive speculation, talk, and theories over his books even years after they have been finished? We can never know for sure what the tower (Gan; ka) truely intends by sending Roland back in time; we can only discuss and come up with our own theories.

[SleepingWarrior]

There was something in the text that something along the lines of: "And then Roland has his choice, a nice quiet life with Susan or his path as a gunslinger". Whether it was the Dark Tower or not, he had some sort o decision.

You're correct. Roland goes into the ball before ambushing Farson's men and sees the Tower for the first time and sees Susan captured but about to be released by Olive Thorin. He believes her to be safe. He always says "Inside the ball I was given a choice: Susan, and my life as her husband and father of the child she carries... or the Tower." Goes on to also say he'd choose Susan in an instant if not for the Tower crumbling.

[Robert Gray]

There was something in the text that something along the lines of: "And then Roland has his choice, a nice quiet life with Susan or his path as a gunslinger". Whether it was the Dark Tower or not, he had some sort o decision.

You should reread the story of Susan Delgado. I believe you are confusing things as there are many books. Roland's choices involving Susan were always in mind with her protection, even as he tried to do his duty. His failure to protect Susan wasn't due to him choosing to sacrifice her or even a lapse in his judgement. Sometimes you can make all the right choices and things still go wrong. That is what happened in the case of Susan Delgado.

So, if Roland knew it was wrong, and doesn't need to learn from his mistakes... why does the Tower send him back?

Why indeed? That is the fundamental question, but also the question which we are unlikely to know the answer to. Perhaps Sai King knows, but I would be surprised if even he knows fully. Consider the following:

*Who says the Tower sends him back at all? We all assume that. How do we know it isn't Roland himself. Let's face it, he is a masochist. It is possible with his indomitable will and reluctance to ever be a peace that it is Roland himself who sends himself back. The Tower and its gift of the horn could be a promise that things might be different. I'm not saying this is the answer. I'm saying it is just as possible as the the one most assume.

I speculated that it was sending him back to achieve his salvation through learning from mistakes and doing things differently since he now had the horn. Granted his memory is erased when he goes back, but what other point to it could there be? (unless Gan is just having fun messing with Roland, laughing at him everytime he gets to the top and putting his reaction on OlympusTube)

I think it is clear that Gan isn't laughing, but I think it is unclear whether or not Gan is sending Roland back at all, much less for the specific purpose of Roland's salvation. Our salvation is always in our own hands. If Gan was truly sending Roland back over and over again until he got it right, "salvation" would be a moot point. It would be a given, a fixed game. That may or may not be true, but I think there is more at work than merely a "Ground Hog Day" scenario.

Obviously Gan knows what is going on, if not Roland, but that was the point of ending the series as he did, was it not? To drive speculation, talk, and theories over his books even years after they have been finished? We can never know for sure what the tower (Gan; ka) truely intends by sending Roland back in time; we can only discuss and come up with our own theories.

Who says you are entitled to know? Gan/God works in mysterious ways. Some questions were never supposed to be answered. The question itself is the point. Some people think it will all repeat again involving the same people. I do not. I think Roland's quest will repeat in a manner fo speaking but the people he draws (if any) will be different people. The worlds he will walk will be other worlds. The foes he fights may even be different foes. His purpose in Gan's scheme (or his own) may simply be the eternal gunslinger who must push a rolling stone up a mountain. Roland's duties may not be for his own good or ill one way or the other but merely pre-ordained by the need of reality (or all realities). We can play the theory game forever but ultimately those things don't matter. They don't even interest me. I only care about the story at hand.

[FakeJake93]

You should reread the story of Susan Delgado. I believe you are confusing things as there are many books. Roland's choices involving Susan were always in mind with her protection, even as he tried to do his duty. His failure to protect Susan wasn't due to him choosing to sacrifice her or even a lapse in his judgement. Sometimes you can make all the right choices and things still go wrong. That is what happened in the case of Susan Delgado.

I know he didn't "sacrifice" her, but in his head, as stated by SleepingWarrior, he made the mental decision to give up his life for the Dark Tower instead of staying with Susan in Mejis. Though this didn't kill her, in a sense, it was a sacrifice, even if the stakes were not her life.

Why indeed? That is the fundamental question, but also the question which we are unlikely to know the answer to. Perhaps Sai King knows, but I would be surprised if even he knows fully. Consider the following:

*Who says the Tower sends him back at all? We all assume that. How do we know it isn't Roland himself. Let's face it, he is a masochist. It is possible with his indomitable will and reluctance to ever be a peace that it is Roland himself who sends himself back. The Tower and its gift of the horn could be a promise that things might be different. I'm not saying this is the answer. I'm saying it is just as possible as the the one most assume.

Interesting theory; that seems to make more sense... the text leads away from this belief is when it says "They were the hands of Gan, the hands of ka, and they knew no mercy." But I guess, technically, the hands could be helping Roland send himself back (if he is being sent back. My theory had always been that it was his own private hell, reliving the same experience within himself). And the tower does seem to symbolize his endless quest. All of the rooms surround the steps to the tower, symbolizing how ever aspect of his life has branched off of and surrounded this quest, the staircase. But still, when Roland thinks: "To hell with the tower" in book 7.... it just makes you wonder why Roland would choose to send himself back, even at a subconscious level.

I think it is clear that Gan isn't laughing, but I think it is unclear whether or not Gan is sending Roland back at all, much less for the specific purpose of Roland's salvation. Our salvation is always in our own hands. If Gan was truly sending Roland back over and over again until he got it right, "salvation" would be a moot point. It would be a given, a fixed game. That may or may not be true

It might not necessarily be a moot point; he could never get his salvation and just stay on the loop for eternity.

I think there is more at work than merely a "Ground Hog Day" scenario.

That... or it's a pot-boiler. I certainly hope not, though. Whether there was an intended theme or not, you can at least make one up for yourself if there isn't one.

Who says you are entitled to know? Gan/God works in mysterious ways. Some questions were never supposed to be answered. The question itself is the point. Some people think it will all repeat again involving the same people. I do not. I think Roland's quest will repeat in a manner fo speaking but the people he draws (if any) will be different people. The worlds he will walk will be other worlds. The foes he fights may even be different foes. His purpose in Gan's scheme (or his own) may simply be the eternal gunslinger who must push a rolling stone up a mountain. Roland's duties may not be for his own good or ill one way or the other but merely pre-ordained by the need of reality (or all realities). We can play the theory game forever but ultimately those things don't matter. They don't even interest me. I only care about the story at hand.

As I stated in my post, the reason he ended it like that was drived to have speculation continue even after it was written. I never said I thought I was entitled to know.

But yes, in theory, we could play the theory game forever.[/irony] The story will always be the best part of the Dark Tower, for without the story, there are no theories. It's just that not much discussion can be made over the story, seeing how what has been said has been said, and the only thing left to discuss on the story aspect of it is your own opinions.