About Roman Polanski issue....

[staropeace]

Anyone following the news about Roman Polanski?

Anyone hear Whoppi Goldbergs comments? What say you?

I say that powerful,rich and famous folks have too much of a halo effect with the public. They forget that they arent actually as smart as the teleprompter or script pages appear to make them. They arent informed anymore than anyone else.

Bet Whoppi wished she had shut her piehole...big big...

http://jam.canoe.ca/Movies/2009/09/30/11202901-wenn-story.html

[Kim L.]

Having sex with a 13-year-old girl who's drunk and stoned is not consensual sex; it's rape.

[Doc Wilson]

Absolutely ridiculous and sadly typical. I have no sympathy for the child raping auteur and even less for his boneheaded defenders. Put him in the cell next to Spector.

[jnote]

This is a hard one as many times it is consentual sex. But, it still doesn't make it legal. He needs to serve his time like anyone else convicted of rape. As anyone who is a parent of a 13 year old knows, they aren't thinking like the adult and the adult is taking full advantage of their innocence.

[bopropadop]

I've read several pieces saying how poor Mr. Polanski has paid his dues for this crime over the past 30 years living as a fugitive in France. Let me see if I have this right... For 30 years he's lived like a Prince leading a jet setting life and because he couldn't re-enter the US, he's been punished enough?

This man pled guilty to unlawful sex with a minor (statutory rape) in order to avoid a trial. Then he fled before sentencing (another crime). How can anyone defend that? He raped a 13-year old girl.

And if I hear one more person say it wasn't "rape" rape, I think I'll scream. According to the grand-jury testimony, the victim clearly asked Polanski to stop, and he did not. When asked by the Deputy D.A. why she did not more forcefully resist Polanski, the girl replied, "Because I was afraid of him." Folks, that's "rape" rape.

Bring his *ss back to the States, sentence him, and make him serve his time. Put him in a cell with Bubba the Love King and let him be on the receiving end for a month or two. And when he gets out, add him to list of sex offenders where his crime can be recorded for posterity.

[IfSoGirl]

he was charged w/ multiple things. my question is why did they wait 30 years to try to get him back? i was reading however that the girl just wants this to go away, for it all to just stop, she doesnt really care about it anymore. she's moved on and grown up thankfully. and yeah whoopie's statements not too bright and her trying to back track and say oh no that's not what i meant. it was rape by my definition.

[Mr Nobody]

If it had been Rick the crackhead from down the road, it might not even be a ripple and it certainly wouldn't divide people: everyone would just go 'Yep, finally getting what he deserved'.
The fuss comes because of Polanski's status as a director. People have been going 'Ah, yes, but he's a genius'. So, by that logic, if Albert Einstein had admitted to similar crimes, it would have been OK?
Seems like a lot of 'slebs want one law for us, and one law for them because they are somehow better.
I keep reading too about how smart some of these folks really are (Sharon Stone has/had an IQ of 156, etc etc etc). It's a shame, then, that when the chance arises, they don't show how smart they are by shutting the hell up.
A paedophile is a paedophile. A rapist is a rapist. And someone ask Whoopi, if it wasn't 'rape-rape', then how off her face on the drink and drugs he plied the girl with would the kid have to be before it qualified as 'rape-rape' in her world?

The only slight qualm I have about it is the method used. Could his lawyers argue entrapment, as he was lured, or does that only apply to non-convicts/pre-trial cases?
If they can go for entrapment, expect his release.

All the celebrity support for him has left a proper sour taste, I have to say. I guess it'd be OK if a 'genius' fiddled with their kids.
From now on, I see the Hollywood sign on TV, I'm going to have The Cuckoo Waltz going through my head. Or Dizzee Rascal's 'Bonkers'.

[AngelZ]

How did we sink to the point, where a significant fraction can defend him? The testimony given by both Roman Polanski and the 13 year old girl clearly portrays Polanski as a predator. Read the actual testimony here: http://www.thesmokinggun.com/archive/polanskicover1.html

[Nero]

He should absolutely be tried there is no excuse for taking advantage of a young girl. Regardless of how willing she may have been, she was in the wiles of a celebrity, in another huge celebrities home, while being doped up and at the age of puberty being photographed in risquè ways... there are a lot of factors there where the girl was at a disadvantage mentally and physically to probably put up much of a fight.

And I've always been a little leery of old Jack on this one too... I know he had an alibi but still, something funny there.

Roman is a guy who's mind has been tainted and messed up by what he's been through. First the Nazis and then the Manson family... intead of rising above it, he feels he can do what he wants apparently. I don't want to judge him too much because he's obviously been through more than most of us have, but taking advantage of a young girl is inexcusable and he should pay like everyone else.

Now if he were to be tried and convicted, would he be added to the sex offender list? Or would ex post facto apply in this case? Can't remember whether it applies to when the crime occured or when the conviction took place.

[Moderator]

I haven't been following the recent events closely but were any charges ever brought against the mother, such as child endangerment, if she was aware that her daughter was in an environment that could lead to something like this happening?

I'm not saying that Roman Polanski shouldn't be held accountable, as I believe he should and his celebrity status should not be a shield to keep him from the same consequences as anyone else. But the girl's mother should also be held accountable for not protecting her daughter. JMO

[michal]

Have to say honestly that I am extremely disgusted with the whole thing, as I usually do as far as pedophiles are concerned. This custom of taking advantage of young girls - or in some cases boys, should deserve the harshest of punishments.

[JohnDalglish]

Hi,

Just heard about the most disgusting case of child sexual abuse I've ever heard.

An English nursery nurse, Vanessa George, and two others plead guilty to the sexual abuse of around fifty children aged between one year and eighteen months.

The three guilty have never met, but corresponded via Facebook.

Words fail me.

Long days and pleasant nights

[txmatt]

I hate to hear some in Holy'wood protecting a pedophile. I wish someone would call those folks out and make them defend their defense of a rapist.

[Mr Nobody]

Ms. Mod: Yep, that too. Can't fail to agree. He might have done the crime, but the mother/parents failed in their duty of care.

JD: It's utterly vile. Didn't know about the Facebook angle. The dark side of the internet, or what.

Makes you wonder. Society is meant to protect and nurture its young. Increasingly, our society and culture seems to do the opposite. That being the case, is it any wonder there are those queuing up to kill it off? And who know, if it's become rabid, letting it die might not be such a bad thing?
(That's not to say I'd embrace any of the current alternatives, and certainly not that espoused by loonies in the ME.)
At the very least, it makes me recall the claim that, as a species, we are fundamentally insane.

[Terry B]

I don't condone what he did any more than anyone else, but even the girl (who is now 45) wants to put this all behind her. There are more important issues in the world today than what Polanski did or did not get away with.

[Jaedpact]

Uh, I want to be "Bubba the Love King" For Haloween. That is GENIUS@!!~

[Dana Jean]

There seems to be some problem with the case. Apparently the reason he fled was, he was given a "deal". He served the time that went with this deal (I think 45 days). They let him go, and then the judge tried to renege on the deal. Once a sentence is handed down, doesn't it become double jeopardy to try to re-do it? You can't keep pulling someone back in because you did a major cluster f**k in your sentencing. If that were possible, think how many sentences would be changed after some time had passed and more information came to light? Once the verdict and sentence are handed down, it's a done deal. And this deal was wrong from the get-go.

Roman Polansky is a child molester. He should have been slammed in prison. I am disgusted that all these people are signing this petition to get him freed. What? If you run far enough for long enough, you win? No. But, apparently he served the time the judge ordered. He did his time.

So, we need to take a closer look at the judge. What was he thinking to make such a deal? What behind-the-scenes agreement was made? Did his bank account suddenly grow?

And definitely, where was the mother AND father in all this?

[staropeace]

I dont see what issue would be more important than the safety of a child...no matter that time has softened all the jagged edges and made it less horrific. This can and will happen again.
When I was studying psychology,I had one brillant wonderful prof who had done councilling in a large prison for a spell. He told us about some of his experiences...some dreadful!
One thing he noticed was that sociology students and other folks who had some contact with inmates had trouble understanding that a super intelligent inmate can be just as evil as a dumb one. Being smart shouldnt get anyone out of prison. Time after time,when some inmate writes a book,or draws amazing pictures,etc,there is often a cry from the public to gain his release. Because he is gifted ???????
Roman is a sleezeball.....thou a gifted one....but he is still a piece of crap.

[AngelZ]

I haven't been following the recent events closely but were any charges ever brought against the mother, such as child endangerment, if she was aware that her daughter was in an environment that could lead to something like this happening?

I'm not saying that Roman Polanski shouldn't be held accountable, as I believe he should and his celebrity status should not be a shield to keep him from the same consequences as anyone else. But the girl's mother should also be held accountable for not protecting her daughter. JMO

It is my understanding from what I've read and heard that the mother encouraged the daughter to have a "relationship" with Roman Polanski so that the daughter's career could be furthered.

[devious1]

There seems to be some problem with the case. Apparently the reason he fled was, he was given a "deal". He served the time that went with this deal (I think 45 days). They let him go, and then the judge tried to renege on the deal. Once a sentence is handed down, doesn't it become double jeopardy to try to re-do it? You can't keep pulling someone back in because you did a major cluster f**k in your sentencing. If that were possible, think how many sentences would be changed after some time had passed and more information came to light? Once the verdict and sentence are handed down, it's a done deal. And this deal was wrong from the get-go.

Roman Polansky is a child molester. He should have been slammed in prison. I am disgusted that all these people are signing this petition to get him freed. What? If you run far enough for long enough, you win? No. But, apparently he served the time the judge ordered. He did his time.

So, we need to take a closer look at the judge. What was he thinking to make such a deal? What behind-the-scenes agreement was made? Did his bank account suddenly grow?

And definitely, where was the mother AND father in all this?well this info isn't quite right... he pled guilty and accepted the plea deal, the 45 days he spent in jail was when they were holding him until sentencing. he had not been sentenced yet. however after accepting the plea deal, the judge wanted to renege and give him a harsher sentence. it was on the day of sentencing that Polanski fled. so it would not be a case of double jeopardy, or a judge changing an already-being-served sentence... however it is still unethical and unprofessional of a judge to change the sentence after a plea has been accepted. if he didn't like the deal, then why did he accept it??? the ironic thing is, Polanski went all the way to the US Supreme court to try to have the case thrown out on that basis (of course, his lawyers were the ones in court, not him). the supreme court refused to dismiss the case but said that the trial was riddled with errors and the ruling stands a good shot at being overturned. so if he did come back and try to fight it, he might have a chance. but he'd rather fight against having to face the music at all... that says a lot about the kind of man he is.

[Dana Jean]

Thanks for clearing that up devious. In my news, they made it sound like the 45 day deal was it and he was free.

It is too bad that the case was so messed up to begin with. I wonder what difference it will make in the case seeing as how he fled?

[Countrygirl_sass]

Well I did not know Whoopi said that. She lost brownie points with me big time. What is "rape-rape"? Is is just molesting some minor? Well thats illegal too Whoopie. Geez, sudo-celebs who thing they are owed a free pass, because most times they get a free pass.

The only problem I have with this is that it should have been taken care of a long time ago. Actually he should have served his little bit of time, what a month, and been done with it. But he is a skunk who preys on children. If it wasn't so he would not have settled with the girl when she sued him.

[Srbo]

This is going to sound terrible, but I don`t care if his name is Roman Polanski or whatever-whoever:

Put the pedophile in a prison with very bad criminals, preferably all of them homosexuals, close the gate - and forget about him.

That`s all.

As for the mother :

Don`t really know what they can do to her now, maybe in case that she has any grandchildern, she should be denied of ever taking care of them...

[staropeace]

Oooops....

[NathanStrickland]

I don't want to wade too deeply into the issue since there are a lot of emotional landmines laying around, but there is one thing I'd like to offer to the group:

How does this whole sorry episode make you feel about justice? What is justice? Is justice for the victim, who just wants to forget it all and live her life, or is justice for the community, which wants to feel that it is safe from predators? How do you untangle the knot of wrongs and get to the bottom of what is right? Is it even possible at this point?

Perhaps most importantly, have we learned anything from this for the next time that a respected, talented, tragic figure does something abominable? Will we do better next time?

Ka is a wheel, after all.

[w666]

This article (please take a moment to read it) sums it up as well as any I've seen:

http://www.salon.com/mwt/broadsheet/feature/2009/09/28/polanski_arrest/index.html

[rjt65]

this is a bizarre case--- 35 years ago man oh man

he fled - he is a criminal--he should have stayed and dealt.

he is guilty A 13yer old girl!!!!!! .. (i have 13 year old girl) and if she was mine he would not have had a chance to flee.

i have no clue what the mother did, so wont comment on her fault or lack of fault.

quite honestly i was sickened that he was given and oscar -- a felon should not be up for awards.

Amazing what money and show biz connections can do for u.

If he was a regular guy---- how different would this be?

[Dana Jean]

That was a great article w666. Thanks for the link.

[BlueCeleste]

I can't stand the news on this anymore. Frankly I think is action is dispicable, he should just be a man, own up to his mistakes (he says he's sorry but he won't own up? Action speaks louder than words and as far as I'm concerned, his action is saying he isn't sorry!) go back to US and face the justice system. I don't care how talented you are, you have to pay your dues like the rest of us. If this were anyone else, we wouldn't be having this debate. And I have loved his movies but I am sick and tired of how some people feel this is some kind of social injustice to put a talented man in jail, are you kidding me? Sorry rant over...

[BlueCeleste]

I haven't been following the recent events closely but were any charges ever brought against the mother, such as child endangerment, if she was aware that her daughter was in an environment that could lead to something like this happening?

I'm not saying that Roman Polanski shouldn't be held accountable, as I believe he should and his celebrity status should not be a shield to keep him from the same consequences as anyone else. But the girl's mother should also be held accountable for not protecting her daughter. JMO

Yes, I completely agree the mother should be held accountable. Somehow, I feel no one will be, he's going to go wherever he goes and her mother will never face a day in court. :glare:
What does this show to the world? That as long as the mother consented, it's not rape? It just baffle me how unscrupulous some parents are to gain fame.

[JayneH]

Might not be the most popular here but I am torn. Yes what he did was disgusting and vile but what I think is important here is what the Victim wants in all of this.

If SHE does not want him brought back to serve time - If SHE does not want the case pursued - then we should respect HER views. This crime happened to her - not to me, you or your child. He has not reoffended in the past 30 years so dont see that there is much of a chance of that happening - so why do it?

If the victim wanted him to come back and face justice then I would be the first to get him on a plane.

Just my opinion - which we all have the right to have !

[scratchesass]

Quote from the great classic "The Waterboy"..... Cut his f-king head off!

(sorry Ms Mod, I'll understand if you don't post it......)

[SusanNorton]

Disgusting....

Roman Polanski is one of my favorite directors. Rosemary's Baby is in my top five favorite movies. I try very hard to keep artists' private lives and their work seperate, because I want to be able to enjoy the work. But jeez...

I've heard about this case for 30+ years, and always assumed the girl was a Lolita, or that maybe she looked older than her years. But 13 years old??? At 13 I still held out hope that Santa was really real, and was mortified at the recent discovery that people kissed with tongues.

Did any of you read the book, "The Godfather?" I hope my memory is correct on this, but there was a scene where a mother drops her young teenaged daughter (very young, probably 13) off at the home of a famous director/producer. I wonder if this was written before or after the Polanski rape? I'll have to check it out. I can't imagine leaving my daughter alone with a strange man - I don't even leave my daughter alone with my brother-in-law.

I know the victim wants this to be over, but Polanski needs to pay for this crime, if for no other reason than to show that nobody is above the law. Like Bernie Madoff, he should spend his remaining years in jail, reflecting on what he's done wrong, and asking himself if it was worth it.

Raping a child is murder, in a way - to kill their trust and innocence, and rob them of their choice of how and when to become sexual - and I hope his sentence is severe. Do you think this was a one-time occurrence?

[Nero]

Quote from the great classic "The Waterboy"..... Cut his f-king head off!

(sorry Ms Mod, I'll understand if you don't post it......)

Youuuu can do it!

[Countrygirl_sass]

I am pretty sure that if the victim had not sued him and got a settlement she would have a different view. And that is just my op.:smile2:

[SusanNorton]

I just read the Salon article. This bit of it was especially infuriating:

The girl told police at the time she had repeatedly told Polanski no; on the screen Zenovich runs a line to that effect from the girl's grand jury testimony, but immediately follows it with a quote from Polanski's: "She was not unresponsive."

As if a rapist in predatory mode can see anything but his own lust and need to dominate. If she had been screaming, crying, and scratching at his privates with her fingernails, he probably would have said, "She needed coaxing, but was up for it."

I remember a Life photo series on Nastassja Kinski (sp?). It was in 1980-81, and she was a teenager. In one photo she was sitting by a pool nude, with her knees pulled up to her chest to hide her breasts, and her ankles crossed. The photographer was Roman Polanski, with whom she had a relationship from the age of 15. I'm sickened by the support he's receiving; he's clearly a pedophile and a rapist.

[Kim L.]

The case is in the hands of the justice system, not the victim, and not of us. Certainly her wish to be spared being part of a media circus should be respected.

[hipmamajen]

She was 13 years old. It wouldn't matter if she'd broken into his house and thrown herself naked at his feet yelling, "Take me, take me Mr. Polanski!" A 13 year old can't legally give consent. Even under those circumstances, a sex act between them would have been rape.

And, she didn't ask him to have sex with her, she asked him several times to stop. He drugged her and forced himself on her.

So, not only was she too young to give consent, she specifically and repeatedly asked him to stop, but he did it anyway.

That is "rape rape" no matter what anyone says. That's a crime, and there are penalties for that in our country, even if you make good movies and give money to the victim and you hide out for a really long time. There's no gray area here.

[Perse Jr.]

The man is a disgusting pig. He knew what he was doing was wrong. The sad sacks in Hollywood couldn't dare part their brilliant Polanski, so they kept him in their pathetic circle. I banned his work a long time ago. Sicko, disgusting, pathetic pig...lucky for him he had connections, money, all the comforts he ever needed, I'm sure. Did I say he's a pig yet? PIG! Actually, that's not fair to the swine community. He is a tiny piece of grimy, slimy fecal matter found in the dark recesses of a public porto-potty in a sewer reconstruction work site.

[Todash]

Might not be the most popular here but I am torn. Yes what he did was disgusting and vile but what I think is important here is what the Victim wants in all of this.

If SHE does not want him brought back to serve time - If SHE does not want the case pursued - then we should respect HER views. This crime happened to her - not to me, you or your child. He has not reoffended in the past 30 years so dont see that there is much of a chance of that happening - so why do it?

If the victim wanted him to come back and face justice then I would be the first to get him on a plane.

Just my opinion - which we all have the right to have !I am sorry for the victim. It is unfortunate that her life is turned into a circus whenever the topic comes up in the media. However, the justice system does not exist primarily to protect individual victims; it exists to protect society as a whole. I have not done any official research on the topic, but I suspect that sexual predators probably have some of the worst rates of recidivism of any criminals. We do not know that he has not committed any similar crimes in the past 30 years, only that he has not been caught (or if he has, his life of privilege has protected him).

And in fact, he did have a relationship with Natassja Kinski, as SusanNorton pointed out, starting from when she was 15 and he was around 43. I don't know how she felt about that, but I did find this quote about how she felt about her early nudity in films: "If I had had somebody to protect me or if I had felt more secure about myself, I would not have accepted certain things. Nudity things. And inside it was just tearing me apart." I wonder if she felt like an adult, with adult knowledge and power, in her relationship with him. I doubt it.

Neither advanced age nor professional accomplishment nor the ability to evade capture for 30 years should entitle a person to escape justice.

[Perse Jr.]

Neither advanced age nor professional accomplishment nor the ability to evade capture for 30 years should entitle a person to escape justice.

Just hitting the "thank you" button is not enough. THANK YOU! Grazie! Dekuju! Xie-xie! Muchas gracias! Faleminderit! Gratia! Shunorhagalam! Euxaristw! Multumesc! Danke sch�n! Diolch! Mnogo blagodarya! Mahalo! Aciu! Dank je wel! Spasibo! Kiitos paljon! Danke! Dyakuyu! Merci beaucoup! Dua Netjer en etj! Tak! Takk! Tack! Dziekuje bardzo!

[PatInTheHat]

Since he had a plea bargain arranged with the prosecution, that the judge has no obligation to honor, and evidently wasn't going to, his single plea of guilty is a legal moot point, whether anyone likes it or not...sorry.
It would mean a trial, or possibly, depending on California state law, another possible plea bargain.
Since the victim has made a settlement with the twisted bastard, and doesn't wish to be involved in any prosecution, I don't really see the point in going forward and disrupting her life anymore than this recent development already has.
But (I sure does :love:'s me them buts), I would sincerely hope there isn't a California statute of limitation on international flight to avoid prosecution, and further hope the legal eagles out there are hip enough to go for it.
She wouldn't need to be involved, and that's just gotta be a slam dunk don't ya think?
Usually flight to avoid prosecution can have some serious time attached...he deserves no less.

[tillyn]

I agree whole heartily with everyone here, predator for sure. I hope Bubba the love King has his bed warmed up for him.( right on Bop.)

[poisonbat]

All I can say is if some pervert drugged and had sex with my 16 year old daughter I would consider it rape. I don't care if it was the most powerful man on earth, it would still be rape. She is not old enough to consent to having sex at her age. So at 13????? Of Course it was rape. :eek2:

[SharonC]

Hi,

Just heard about the most disgusting case of child sexual abuse I've ever heard.

An English nursery nurse, Vanessa George, and two others plead guilty to the sexual abuse of around fifty children aged between one year and eighteen months.

The three guilty have never met, but corresponded via Facebook.

Words fail me.

Long days and pleasant nights

John, that is disgusting. Here, in our part of the world, we have yet another Catholic priest (a bishop, no less) being charged with possession of child pornography. Church officials apparently were aware of this since 1989, and nothing was done about it.

Where does it end? Who can we trust? Children are supposed to be nurtured and protected. Instead too many are abused, physically and sexually and their innocence lost forever.

The free and easy life we led as children is now a thing of the past. It's sad to think that today's children will never know that freedom.

[Tery]

The only question I have is about the statute of limitations. Nobody has mentioned if it has passed.

That said, he committed a crime and he needs to pay for it... and not with $$$$. I don't care how good a director he is -- and I agree that he is --- he broke the law, harmed that girl and ran away. He needs to deal with it.

[JohnK]

While there are many times when teens have consented to have sex with those who are older then them, they are still children, especially a thirteen year old. It is not like the child in question was 17 and Polanski 18. He was a full grown man--over 30 and he drugged this young girl and raped her. He has to go to jail. There are many fine artists in jail, but just because they are artists does not mean that they should be roaming the streets either. I have a daughter who is ten and a half and that is where I stand on this.

[Dana Jean]

[QUOTE=Tery;331076]The only question I have is about the statute of limitations. Nobody has mentioned if it has passed.

And again I'll say, if you run far enough for long enough you win? No. No statute of limitations on child molestation or rape. I hope.

[Terry B]

The only real problem I have with this Polanski issue is this - He's been in Europe (France in particular) for what, over 30 years and he's just now being brought back to justice. We've all known for this 30+ years where he was. He wasn't hiding. He was making movies for crying out loud. Why now do the French authorities decide to apprehend? Just asking.

[malarabid]

From Teen Life Q&A: The Limits of Statutory Rape (http://teenadvice.about.com/od/sexuallyactive/a/statutoryrape1.htm):


What is a statute of limitations? It is the time limit the law puts on police and prosecutors to lay charges in a crime. The statute of limitations was put in place in order to ensure that people are swiftly brought to justice by police and to allow people to move on with their lives without fear of past deeds coming back to get them after they have reformed themselves. It is a controversial legal premise. Murder and treason are the only crimes that do not have a time limit and many people think this is unfair to victims. Victims rights groups point out that victims live with the effects of the crime for their entire lives and that in the interest of justice criminals should have to do the same. However, as things stand now every crime has a statute of limitations attached.

It seems that a statute of limitations would not apply if he was already convicted. It's ordinary for the convicted who are on the run, leave the jurisdiction of their parole without notice, etc, to be charged with further crimes on top of whatever they were already convicted for.

If this case is any different, then there should be a very good reason that can be broadly applied to all people.

[jchanic]

The only question I have is about the statute of limitations. Nobody has mentioned if it has passed.


The statute of limitations (if there is one in California) does not not apply whatsoever because he is NOT being charged and tried for a crime--he's being apprehended as a fugitive AFTER he pled guilty to the crime and fled before sentencing. A world of difference.

John