The insult "retard"

[Todash]

A comment of Shasta's on another post made me think about this. In the past several years, I have tried very hard to stop using the word "retard" as an insult. But it's not because I really *felt* the gravity or offense of it in, say, the same way I understand how very offensive the N word is. (See? I won't even use that word.) Mainly I stopped because I knew some people found it offensive, and unless I have a particular reason to use certain language, I try to avoid offending others. Still, I didn't feel the wrongness of it. It never offended me.

And then Ann Coulter stuck her foot in her mouth again, and in the midst of the public response came this reasonable, heartfelt, and articulate response, and I understood in a way that before I really hadn't how mean and wrong it is to use the word retard as an insult: http://specialolympicsblog.wordpress.com/2012/10/23/an-open-letter-to-ann-coulter/ (http://www.stephenking.com/forums/redirector.php?url=http%3A%2F%2Fspecialolympicsblo g.wordpress.com%2F2012%2F10%2F23%2Fan-open-letter-to-ann-coulter%2F).

I knew it had really stuck when a brother-in-law of mine posted a picture of a person with Downs Syndrome with a mocking caption and instead of being slightly embarrassed at the non-PC-ness of it, I was actually offended (and about to tell him off till I realized that a few months ago I wouldn't have found it offensive myself). I don't think we should take offense when none is intended, and there's a fine line between being overly sensitive and reasonably offended. But yeah, I get it now. I can now say that for me, at least, I do not use that term as an insult. It is no longer "I try not to."

(I still need to figure out why "little people" is the preferred term ... I think I'd rather be called a dwarf or even midget. "Little person" sounds so condescending. I am not sure when that one is gonna stick with me.)

[do1you9love?]

Thanks for posting this. I have had the great pleasure of working with the Virginia Special Olympics for three years and cannot begin to describe how it has changed my outlook in so many ways. Glad you have banned the R-word from your insult list!
:biggrin2:

[fljoe0]

A comment of Shasta's on another post made me think about this. In the past several years, I have tried very hard to stop using the word "retard" as an insult. But it's not because I really *felt* the gravity or offense of it in, say, the same way I understand how very offensive the N word is. (See? I won't even use that word.) Mainly I stopped because I knew some people found it offensive, and unless I have a particular reason to use certain language, I try to avoid offending others. Still, I didn't feel the wrongness of it. It never offended me.

And then Ann Coulter stuck her foot in her mouth again, and in the midst of the public response came this reasonable, heartfelt, and articulate response, and I understood in a way that before I really hadn't how mean and wrong it is to use the word retard as an insult: http://specialolympicsblog.wordpress.com/2012/10/23/an-open-letter-to-ann-coulter/ (http://www.stephenking.com/forums/redirector.php?url=http%3A%2F%2Fspecialolympicsblo g.wordpress.com%2F2012%2F10%2F23%2Fan-open-letter-to-ann-coulter%2F).

I knew it had really stuck when a brother-in-law of mine posted a picture of a person with Downs Syndrome with a mocking caption and instead of being slightly embarrassed at the non-PC-ness of it, I was actually offended (and about to tell him off till I realized that a few months ago I wouldn't have found it offensive myself). I don't think we should take offense when none is intended, and there's a fine line between being overly sensitive and reasonably offended. But yeah, I get it now. I can now say that for me, at least, I do not use that term as an insult. It is no longer "I try not to."

(I still need to figure out why "little people" is the preferred term ... I think I'd rather be called a dwarf or even midget. "Little person" sounds so condescending. I am not sure when that one is gonna stick with me.)

I agree about the "little person" sounding condescending. There are other phrases to like that like calling someone 90 years young. When I'm 90 years old and some fool calls me 90 years young, I'm going to smack that fool with my cane.:biggrin2: This 90 year young guy will still know the a*h* word too.:biggrin2:

[fushingfeef]

I knew a man with dwarfism for several years, and knew him well enough to be able to ask questions about his dwarfism. He said he never liked the term "little person", he said he preferred just being called a "person"! Also, if you asked him the difference between a midget and a dwarf, he would say "about 4 inches!" and would laugh, and would not explain further.

I heard the word "retard" used a lot more when I was a kid, but even back then it was considered a rude word to say--I never started using that word.

[doowopgirl]

Yeah, there is a fine line between over sensitive and reasonably offended. Very hard to know where the line is. I try to never use words that would offend me. By the way, fljoe0, I agree with the term 90 years young. Thats the line of overly sensitive. I hope to be vigorous enough to hit who ever calls me that.

[tenngolfer]

The last time I remember using the word "retard", I was a young boy trading insults with other young boys, not knowing better on that subject and many others.

[Shasta]

I was in Girl Scouts for a good majority of my life. My troop leader's son had down syndrome. To this day he's still one of the most wonderful people I've ever met. When he graduated high school he got a standing ovation.

But.....

I remember how cruel some of the kids were. People would call him a retard to his face and laugh. They would tell other kids "You're as retarded as Cody."

There was nothing kind or innocent about it. When I was young I used the word retard as well but the fact is, when you say it you are never saying it innocently. You are using it to call someone stupid. Plain and simple. And when you are using a way to describe an entire people as an insult, well, it's just mean.

I have to say that I was taught this lesson with the word "gay." To me, it was just a term. Until a gay friend of mine said the exact thing I just said above. It really opened my eyes.

I have no interest in being PC. None. But I do have an interest in not being cruel. I'm very glad that this came up because people cane be very cruel without intention and you don't know it until someone makes you see.

Thanks, Todash!

[Todash]

I knew a man with dwarfism for several years, and knew him well enough to be able to ask questions about his dwarfism. He said he never liked the term "little person", he said he preferred just being called a "person"! That's what I would think!! I just ... I would try not to be offended at the term "little person" since it's the currently accepted term. But ... I just cannot get over how condescending it sounds. I'm pretty sure I would feel the same if I were one! (I don't have that many inches on the taller ones, actually. :laugh:) As far as the midget/dwarf thing goes, I don't think that midget was ever a medical term, mainly a social one. The medical term is dwarfism, but I think the social distinction had to do with proportions. Someone who was considered normally-proportioned for their* height was termed a midget, and someone with abnormal proportions (longer limbs, wider torso, etc.) relative to their* height was termed a dwarf. I think. Might be wrong. Been wrong before. Rather a lot, actually.


I heard the word "retard" used a lot more when I was a kid, but even back then it was considered a rude word to say--I never started using that word.Yeah ... I know. I was raised in a flyover state. We don't eat dirt (most of us), and we don't scratch our genitals in public (... at least half of us), but we are pretty backward in some ways.

*I'm beginning to feel that the lack of a singular gender-neutral personal pronoun in the English language is a painful oversight. Who designed this stupid language anyway? Yes, I could have pluralized my nouns. That's not the point.

[king family fan]

I have a child who will participate in the special olympics this year. And am very proud.

[not_nadine]

I have not used that word since I was little and did not know any better either.

Makes me think about "Something about Mary" when whats his name was asking Mary about her job.
They tried to make it funny, because everyone knows it's not a word to use anymore.

[GNTLGNT]

....all manner of words hurt...many of them still haunt me 40 plus years down the road....

[Spideyman]

Labels belong on cans, not people. A person is a person.

[AnnaMarie]

I've never used the word as an insult. I have used it as a medical term. As in a boy I used to babysit was mentally retarded. That's the term his family used. He would never learn to speak, or communicate in any way. He was unable to even use a crayon to scribble. I always thought the word meant that growth (ie mental growth) had stopped prematurely.

But many find it offensive to be used even as a medical term.

But used as an insult? never! If I want to insult someone, I'm not going to compare him to a loving boy who at 17 still gave me those messy toddler kisses when he saw me.

[kingricefan]

I was in Girl Scouts for a good majority of my life. My troop leader's son had down syndrome. To this day he's still one of the most wonderful people I've ever met. When he graduated high school he got a standing ovation.

But.....

I remember how cruel some of the kids were. People would call him a retard to his face and laugh. They would tell other kids "You're as retarded as Cody."

There was nothing kind or innocent about it. When I was young I used the word retard as well but the fact is, when you say it you are never saying it innocently. You are using it to call someone stupid. Plain and simple. And when you are using a way to describe an entire people as an insult, well, it's just mean.

I have to say that I was taught this lesson with the word "gay." To me, it was just a term. Until a gay friend of mine said the exact thing I just said above. It really opened my eyes.

I have no interest in being PC. None. But I do have an interest in not being cruel. I'm very glad that this came up because people cane be very cruel without intention and you don't know it until someone makes you see.

Thanks, Todash!

I try very hard not to use the 'r' word myself. Just yesterday at work I was joking around with a co-worker and they said 'Oh, that's just retarded.' and I ever-so-politely replied in a jokingly tone 'I'm slightly retarded (no, I am not, although some of you might disagree.......) and I am offended by what you just said.', to which they stopped, looked at me and said 'You know, that wasn't very PC of me to say and I apologize.' I think by using humor, I was able to get my point across and not have it turn into a big ugly mess. Now, when someone around me says something like 'That's so gay.' in which they mean stupid, I do take them to task, by pointing out that they are using that word in the wrong context and thereby inferring that gay is stupid. I've gotten into a few heated discussions over this, but I have to stand up for myself and my fellow gay folk. You just simply cannot make up a new meaning for a word and expect to not be accountable for it. I don't know exactly when the word gay came to equal stupid, it just sort of slipped into everyday use. Most people who use it in the way to mean stupid don't realize that it IS offensive to gays and alot of other people. Whoopie Goldberg gets really upset about this particular 'new' terminalogy.

[Moderator]

I think you know how I feel about gays and homosexuality, KRF, so hope you will take this in the context it's intended, but I have to take issue with your comment about making up a new meaning for the word gay. There was a time (at least where I grew up) when gay meant to be happy and had nothing to do with one's sexual preference. Just sayin'. That's not in any way defending using the word as meaning stupid, just pointing out that it's not the first time that word has been redefined.

[Neesy]

I have a child who will participate in the special olympics this year. And am very proud.
Guess what? Me, too - my son has been bowling with Special Olympics now for 7 years. He is high functioning and I am lucky to have him. I have seen how he could be treated differently in the past and kids can be cruel. In his case he looks perfectly normal so it is difficult because he presents well. He has been taken advantage of by unscrupulous people in the past so I tend to be overprotective (typical Mom I guess). I was guilty of using that word in the past a long time ago. I do not think it is commonly used now. Cognitively challenged seems to be one of the catch phrases lately. Anyway, try watching that movie with Johnny Knoxville called "The Ringer". As my husband would say "It's a cracker!" (That means it's pretty funny):p

[Becks19]

After reading that letter to Anne Coulter, IMO John Franklin Stephens has more dignity, class, and brains than Coulter ever will.

[blunthead]

...when someone around me says something like 'That's so gay.' in which they mean stupid, I do take them to task...To me this expression has for some reason sounded synonymous with "that's so high" or "you're so high". I'm not saying that I think "gays" are high, nor that quotation marks are demeaning or even very necessary.

I think if you're gay you have to say so, and if you're high you have to be careful who you tell.

I think sometimes highness equals inaneness and sometimes it equals brilliance and sometimes it equals a Queen. Or a Prince.

[Todash]

I've never used the word as an insult. I have used it as a medical term. As in a boy I used to babysit was mentally retarded. That's the term his family used. He would never learn to speak, or communicate in any way. He was unable to even use a crayon to scribble. I always thought the word meant that growth (ie mental growth) had stopped prematurely.

But many find it offensive to be used even as a medical term.

But used as an insult? never! If I want to insult someone, I'm not going to compare him to a loving boy who at 17 still gave me those messy toddler kisses when he saw me.

Now that ... sigh. Retarded is a perfectly fine word. It means, essentially, slow. Late. And there's really no other term that means the same thing. I think it's unfortunate when being politically correct causes us to make the meanings of words unclear, to obscure the topic so that no one is precisely sure what we are talking about. Specifically naming a medical condition or pointing out that someone has one is not, in itself, unkind, and it can facilitate helping the person. The term "hearing impaired" is fine, but it applies equally to someone who has been at the front row of a few too many heavy metal concerts as well as someone who's never heard his name being spoken. To refer to both those people using the same term obfuscates meaning and is confusing, and I don't see how it helps anyone to lump together the man who has a bit of hearing loss and the man who is totally deaf; by necessity, we interact with those people in different ways (example: one can hear us yell a warning to "Stop!", and the other never will; that's a crucial distinction). I find the term "mentally disabled" to be equally frustrating because it cripples our ability to understand and assist where needed. I don't know why it's deemed helpful to pretend there ARE no differences between us, when clearly, there are. I have two adult nephews who are "mentally disabled." One is moderately to severely autistic; he communicates somewhat ... but he's affected enough that it's really difficult to tell what or how much he is thinking. He's never going to be able to live on his own. The other is mildly retarded; he's a little slow to grasp abstract concepts, but even though he lives at home, with a little support he would be fine on his own. The catchall term mentally disabled isn't particularly helpful, in my opinion, because really it doesn't mean much of anything.

I know the goal is to realize that no matter how different you seem from the person sitting next to you, you really have much more in common than not, but I just don't think using generic umbrella terms and/or avoiding using any terms at all accomplishes that goal.

[Spideyman]

From an adjective to a noun. Meanings change. For my generation gay was a term of being happy. The world moved on and so did the meaning.

The term was originally used to refer to feelings of being "carefree", "happy", or "bright and showy". The term's use as a reference to homosexuality may date as early as the late 19th century, but its use gradually increased in the 20th century.[1] In modern English, gay has come to be used as an adjective, and as a noun, referring to the people, especially to males, and the practices and cultures associated with homosexuality.

By the end of the 20th century, the word gay was recommended by major LGBT groups and style guides to describe people attracted to members of the same sex.[2][3] At about the same time, a new, pejorative use became prevalent in some parts of the world. In the Anglosphere, this connotation, among younger speakers, has a derisive meaning equivalent to rubbish or stupid (as in "That's so gay."). In this use, the word does not mean "homosexual", so it can be used, for example, to refer to an inanimate object or abstract concept of which one disapproves. This usage can also refer to weakness or unmanliness. When used in this way, the extent to which it still retains connotations of homosexuality has been debated and harshly criticized.[4][5]

[Todash]

To me this expression has for some reason sounded synonymous with "that's so high" or "you're so high". I'm not saying that I think "gays" are high, nor that quotation marks are demeaning or even very necessary.

I think if you're gay you have to say so, and if you're high you have to be careful who you tell.

I think sometimes highness equals inaneness and sometimes it equals brilliance and sometimes it equals a Queen. Or a Prince.
I don't completely understand this post, but I grok it enough to grasp the sheer awesomeness of it.

[blunthead]

I don't completely understand this post, but I grok it enough to grasp the sheer awesomeness of it.
:laugh::laugh::laugh:

[Dana Jean]

Words have the power we give them. What is no big deal to use for one, is a very big deal to another. I use all words equally, and I definitely put my foot in it all the time. A lot of how a word is used is the context. I can definitely laugh at words used in humor; and I am livid when the same word is used in anger or meanness.

I only have one word that I personally find offensive each and every time it's used. It doesn't matter if it's used in humor or in meanness, I loathe this word. Just one. And, I am smart enough to now if someone's intention is humor or ugliness and I process it accordingly.

I have only heard this word used in anger. There is a lot of hate when I've heard this word. And I've been called this word by people who supposedly love me.

[kingricefan]

I think you know how I feel about gays and homosexuality, KRF, so hope you will take this in the context it's intended, but I have to take issue with your comment about making up a new meaning for the word gay. There was a time (at least where I grew up) when gay meant to be happy and had nothing to do with one's sexual preference. Just sayin'. That's not in any way defending using the word as meaning stupid, just pointing out that it's not the first time that word has been redefined.

You speak true, no harm, no foul. :biggrin2:

[LongTallSally]

When I was growing up, 'retard' was a word that could get you into trouble at school. I'm 44 and I KNEW as a child that you didn't use that word. Some of the other kids in school tried to circumvent the rules and started saying 'retread' instead. I'm a mechanic's kid so I kept asking what it had to do with putting new treads on tires. Name calling is just not fun.

[Becks19]

Name calling is just not fun.

And some, go beyond name calling.http://www.wdtn.com/dpp/news/ohio/ohio-man-gets-jail-for-mocking-disabled-girl#.ULYD-MvNmSo

[Todash]

When I was growing up, 'retard' was a word that could get you into trouble at school. I'm 44 and I KNEW as a child that you didn't use that word. Some of the other kids in school tried to circumvent the rules and started saying 'retread' instead. I'm a mechanic's kid so I kept asking what it had to do with putting new treads on tires. Name calling is just not fun.
You know ... I don't actually remember people using it at school. I really only remember hearing it in the past few decades. Oh well. That's the Midwest for you, behind on everything. I'm surprised (but thankful) that I'm not seeing acid wash jeans and mall bangs everywhere around me.

[kingricefan]

And some, go beyond name calling.http://www.wdtn.com/dpp/news/ohio/ohio-man-gets-jail-for-mocking-disabled-girl#.ULYD-MvNmSo

At least he apologized! Not alot of info in the article, he says he was only reacting to something said about his son, but it didn't say what, so can't really make a judgement here.

[Dana Jean]

I am watching a 2007 (Marriage Deal Breakers) Dr. Phil show as I write this. He has used "retarded" twice since I've been watching. In context, he's using the word to designate someone being stupid. He is not labeling a whole group of people. The use doesn't bother me, but I understand that the use bothers others.

I think a lot of how and when a word is used has to do with your audience. We must be sensitive to who is listening.

[Shasta]

I am watching a 2007 (Marriage Deal Breakers) Dr. Phil show as I write this. He has used "retarded" twice since I've been watching. In context, he's using the word to designate someone being stupid. He is not labeling a whole group of people. The use doesn't bother me, but I understand that the use bothers others.

I think a lot of how and when a word is used has to do with your audience. We must be sensitive to who is listening.

I personally feel that what he's doing is in turn labeling mentally challenged people as stupid. When you call someone who is dumb (or makes dumb choices) retarded you are in fact in turn calling metally retarded people stupid. And believe me, they aren't. I think that's why people have an issue with it.

[Becks19]

At least he apologized! Not alot of info in the article, he says he was only reacting to something said about his son, but it didn't say what, so can't really make a judgement here.

KingriceFan, Here's a short video of the mimicking. I find it really hard to believe that the man was reacting to something that was said about his son by copying how the disabled girl walks. The second half of this video is also very interesting. http://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory/ohio-man-jail-mocking-disabled-girl-17825332#.ULeaY8vNmSo

[Shasta]

Regardless of if his son was made fun of, this is not an appropriate adult reaction. This is how bullies are made.

[GNTLGNT]

You know ... I don't actually remember people using it at school. I really only remember hearing it in the past few decades. Oh well. That's the Midwest for you, behind on everything. I'm surprised (but thankful) that I'm not seeing acid wash jeans and mall bangs everywhere around me.

...or "Commando" haircuts...think those just finished the rounds hyar...

http://collider.com/wp-content/uploads/commando-movie-image.jpg

[Neesy]

"thankful) that I'm not seeing acid wash jeans and mall bangs everywhere around me"
Todash - what are mall bangs?

[Todash]

"thankful) that I'm not seeing acid wash jeans and mall bangs everywhere around me"
Todash - what are mall bangs?

In the late 80s to early 90s, girls did this thing. Basically, however your hair was otherwise, you had bangs, usually three to four inches long, and every morning before school, you used a big curling iron to curl most of them backward, usually with the bit at the very front curled forward. Then you grabbed a big ol' can of hairspray--Aqua Net was the default--and sprayed and teased and sprayed and teased and sprayed and teased until you ended up with a gravity-defying shellacked poof of hair rising above your forehead like a stiff, fuzzy ball of doom.

It was a dark time.

[Moderator]

Mall bangs

[Neesy]

Mall bangs
Yikes! that picture scared me so much I closed my browser.... thank God I was in the military back then and this look was not allowed. I do recall a civilian who came in with that look around 92 but on her it looked good (believe it or not)

[Todash]

Mall bangs
Yikes! that picture scared me so much I closed my browser.... thank God I was in the military back then and this look was not allowed. I do recall a civilian who came in with that look around 92 but on her it looked good (believe it or not)

Some girls would look good in a paper sack with black facepaint. The rest of us just try to forget what horrible things we did to ourselves in high school ...

I actually see women my age still sporting this look occasionally. It makes me cringe. I am just about the LEAST fashionable person on the planet--I'm so very, very What Not To Wear that if Clinton and Stacy showed up at my door, I would secretly hide all my yoga pants and crappy T-shirts--but at least you can tell I simply don't care that much. Women with mall bangs are making an effort, and that just is so sad to me. But also funny because I do have a little "point and laugh" in me; don't we all?

[Autumn Gust]

I work with a lot of women in their mid-to-late forties and fifties who still have their "high school hair" from the 1970s and 80s. In addition to the flipped back, curling-iron bangs, they are still coloring their hair that same shade of sunwashed blonde. I think they believe it makes them look younger, but, to me, it has the opposite effect.

[Neesy]

"still coloring their hair that same shade of sunwashed blonde"
Mine used to be red (dark auburn) but I cannot keep up with the grey roots. (50 shades of Grey? - you wanna believe it!) I finally broke down and went to a hair dresser as the boxed stuff just wasn't coming out right any more. I was afraid one day it would turn our bright red or orange like Bozo the Clown.

Wow - these threads certainly do morph into other topics, eh?

[Neesy]

"but at least you can tell I simply don't care that much"
Todash - judging from your profile pic you look great! I think maybe women try too hard. In my case, at least, I am kinda glad to be getting older. I hope I can age gracefully and accept myself for what I am (not bad for an older woman! ha ha - my husband used to give me that backhanded compliment)

[Todash]

"still coloring their hair that same shade of sunwashed blonde"
Mine used to be red (dark auburn) but I cannot keep up with the grey roots. (50 shades of Grey? - you wanna believe it!) I finally broke down and went to a hair dresser as the boxed stuff just wasn't coming out right any more. I was afraid one day it would turn our bright red or orange like Bozo the Clown.

Wow - these threads certainly do morph into other topics, eh?Mine do a lot. I'm pretty random. :D

[Todash]

"but at least you can tell I simply don't care that much"
Todash - judging from your profile pic you look great! I think maybe women try too hard. In my case, at least, I am kinda glad to be getting older. I hope I can age gracefully and accept myself for what I am (not bad for an older woman! ha ha - my husband used to give me that backhanded compliment)

Aw, thanks! Actually, I'm looking (in my eyes) quite a bit older lately because I've lost some weight, and the cheeks just aren't so chubby anymore (and thanks for the premature wrinkles, Dad!) ... but that was a bedhead pic I took a few days ago. I went to bed with my hair straight and flat and woke up with it like that. My morning hair cracks me up; it's crazy. I love it. I fully, fully intend to be a crazy old lady when my time comes. Nothing demure for me.

"When I am an old woman I shall wear purple
With a red hat which doesn't go, and doesn't suit me.
And I shall spend my pension on brandy and summer gloves
And satin sandals, and say we've no money for butter."

(Except not really, because I adore butter.)

It's neck down where it all usually goes to heck for me. I'm just a scrub. :tongue:

[Neesy]

"When I am an old woman I shall wear purple
With a red hat which doesn't go, and doesn't suit me.
And I shall spend my pension on brandy and summer gloves
And satin sandals, and say we've no money for butter."

Todash - that is a great poem

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_Hat_Society

16478
Hey - I did it! I inserted an image... There is hope for me yet

[kingricefan]

I work with a lot of women in their mid-to-late forties and fifties who still have their "high school hair" from the 1970s and 80s. In addition to the flipped back, curling-iron bangs, they are still coloring their hair that same shade of sunwashed blonde. I think they believe it makes them look younger, but, to me, it has the opposite effect.

OMG! So do I. And to 'one-up' you, one of them still sports the same bright blue eye shadow to go along with the hair-do!!

[Evil Queen]

We used to use the 'r' word a lot when we were young....'don't be retarded!', 'you're so retarded!'....but since I've had my own children, I try to teach them not to be so mean. They have a couple of cousins who are mentally slower and they see them being made fun of in school by other kids, so they know that being retarded is a slight disability and we don't make fun of people like that. My daughter has had to stick up for her cousin various times at school. Some kids can be really cruel, as we all already know.

[Neesy]

OMG! So do I. And to 'one-up' you, one of them still sports the same bright blue eye shadow to go along with the hair-do!!

Hey - do they look like Mimi in the old episodes of the Drew Carey Show?

[91rewoT]

When I was nine, I had a horrible fight with my best friend. I wrote her a nasty note, in which I called her "retarded". I was hurt and I wanted to hurt her back, so I used the ugliest word I knew at the time. Fortunately, my friend showed the note to our 4th grade teacher, Miss Hamilton (whom I adored). I remember being called to her desk, and I went grudgingly, because I knew I'd done something wrong. Miss Hamilton didn't yell at me, or give me a detention, or call my parents. She did something worse. She told me she was disappointed in me and was surprised that I would say something like that. She told me why I shouldn't use that word. I was devastated. I cried. I was disappointed in myself. I apologized to my friend. And I have never used that word again. Two other words have never been in my vocabulary and never will be - the "n" word and the "c" word. Yes, they are "just words", but they are ugly words and they are meant to hurt or put people down. And I'm sorry, but I don't think that you get to "pick and choose" whether it's an offensive term or not, depending on your "audience". It's offensive and it's derogatory. As many of you know, I work in special education. Every day is a battle to get students to change their language. I try to be like Miss Hamilton and explain to students why they should not use the term "retard". It's not really that hard, to drop a word from your vocabulary if you have a good reason to.

*steps down from soap box*

[kingricefan]

Hey - do they look like Mimi in the old episodes of the Drew Carey Show?

Not quite to that extent but almost!!!!

[Shasta]

Wthe "n" word and the "c" word. *steps down from soap box*

I don't understand the distaste for the "c" word and no one can ever explain it to me. Yes, I understand it's vulgar but so is d*ck or p*n*s and no one seems to have an issue with those. I am personally a big fan of the "c" word. It's just a vulgar word for a body part.

Of course, I would never CALL someone that, but that's mostly because they'd likely take so much offense to it. I call people d*cks all the time!

Am I just taking this conversation to a whole new level it doesn't need to go to?

[Moderator]

It may be a generational thing, Shasta, as my younger daughter sees it in a similar way as you do. It may be that I find it highly offensive because I've only seen/heard it used as a pejorative that is usually used to degrade a female in the lowest terms and the emotion behind its use is most often anger and/or contempt. :dunno:

[Todash]

I don't understand the distaste for the "c" word and no one can ever explain it to me. Yes, I understand it's vulgar but so is d*ck or p*n*s and no one seems to have an issue with those. I am personally a big fan of the "c" word. It's just a vulgar word for a body part.

Of course, I would never CALL someone that, but that's mostly because they'd likely take so much offense to it. I call people d*cks all the time!

Am I just taking this conversation to a whole new level it doesn't need to go to?
I have never been that sensitive to that word either ... but yeah, I would never call someone that because I realize a lot of women view it as the ultimate offense. It does, however, get under my craw to be called a b***h, but that's because I'm not. I try really hard to be decent and not psycho, and I would like those efforts to be noticed please.

[kingricefan]

I don't understand the distaste for the "c" word and no one can ever explain it to me. Yes, I understand it's vulgar but so is d*ck or p*n*s and no one seems to have an issue with those. I am personally a big fan of the "c" word. It's just a vulgar word for a body part.

Of course, I would never CALL someone that, but that's mostly because they'd likely take so much offense to it. I call people d*cks all the time!

Am I just taking this conversation to a whole new level it doesn't need to go to?

Hi, Shasta! You do bring up a good point. I loathe the word (c) you have cited, along with the 'f' word that rhymes with maggot. But, you're right, why don't we get more upset when someone uses the 'd' or 'p' word? I don't know, the 'c' word just really seems a much more vulgar term than the other two words. :dunno:

[Shasta]

It may be a generational thing, Shasta, as my younger daughter sees it in a similar way as you do. It may be that I find it highly offensive because I've only seen/heard it used as a pejorative that is usually used to degrade a female in the lowest terms and the emotion behind its use is most often anger and/or contempt. :dunno:

I'm glad you answered that, thank you!

When I think of how I most often use it heard it's mostly on British entertainment and often in reference to a man. I think I'm going to keep my ears open and see how else I hear it.

In general I just don't think it's very nice to call people names at all, so even though I use the "d" word a lot for pretty much anyone I am trying to stop. It's really just not nice and it often makes me sound just plain uneducated!

[Moderator]

Maybe it's because the "c" word isn't used as often and is only brought out when someone wants to really be offensive--sort of the nuclear response when all else has failed or just doesn't express the level of derision that's "needed" for the situation? :dunno:

[Shasta]

I have never been that sensitive to that word either ... but yeah, I would never call someone that because I realize a lot of women view it as the ultimate offense. It does, however, get under my craw to be called a b***h, but that's because I'm not. I try really hard to be decent and not psycho, and I would like those efforts to be noticed please.

You're NOT psycho? Then how come your new name is Terminator Todash?

It doesn't really bother me to be called the "b" word but then I don't take much credence in what most people say anyway, except the people I care about. If they called me a "b" or a "c" or any other letter of the alphabet I'm sure it would hurt. If some was like, "You're a CAT" but they MEANT it really mean and I cared about them it would probably hurt my feelings.

Okay. I'm rambling now.

[Spideyman]

As MsMod said, it may be a generational thing with the "c" word. For me, it is the most offensive, derogatory word used against a female.
I've stated before, times change and meanings of words change. However, the meaning learned in youth often sticks with you, thus I shutter when I hear that word used in todays conversations.

[Todash]

You're NOT psycho? Then how come your new name is Terminator Todash?Because some people just need killing. It's nothing personal; I'm culling the herd. It's for the best. :biggrin2:


It doesn't really bother me to be called the "b" word but then I don't take much credence in what most people say anyway, except the people I care about. Oh, yeah, I don't care what random people think. If I did, I would dress better.

Okay. I'm rambling now.
I started the thread. Ramble all you want.

[Shasta]

As MsMod said, it may be a generational thing with the "c" word. For me, it is the most offensive, derogatory word used against a female.
I've stated before, times change and meanings of words change. However, the meaning learned in youth often sticks with you, thus I shutter when I hear that word used in todays conversations.

That does make sense. Maybe I'll just ban it too because our society REALLY doesn't need another insult to hurl at people.

[Autumn Gust]

Hearing all of those words in every day talk (the "c" word, the "b" word, the "f" word, etc...) doesn't so much offend me as makes me bored and a little sad. Bored because I'm tired of hearing them since junior high, and they now seem really lame to me. Sad, because we've crossed a line by accepting them into our common speech and have set a new less respectful standard. Besides, if you're smart, you can get your exact same point across without resorting to vulgar words. I think that's pretty sexy!

[Neesy]

Hi, Shasta! You do bring up a good point. I loathe the word (c) you have cited, along with the 'f' word that rhymes with maggot. But, you're right, why don't we get more upset when someone uses the 'd' or 'p' word? I don't know, the 'c' word just really seems a much more vulgar term than the other two words. :dunno:
Do you remember the movie "Porky's" (giving away my age here) as in "Mike Hunt on the phone" phone prank? I do not care one way or the other for this word. I think we give it more strength by not using it (?) so that it's more shocking.

[Evil Queen]

Two other words have never been in my vocabulary and never will be - the "n" word and the "c" word. Yes, they are "just words", but they are ugly words and they are meant to hurt or put people down.

They're not in my vocabulary either, I sincerely despise those words.

[Todash]

Do you remember the movie "Porky's" (giving away my age here) as in "Mike Hunt on the phone" phone prank? I do not care one way or the other for this word. I think we give it more strength by not using it (?) so that it's more shocking.

I know I'm in the minority, probably, but ... I don't really like swears in general. And linguistically, I think it is important for any language to have words it considers shocking. Because words express concepts, and I think it is important that societally, there are concepts we consider shocking. It's also important to have concepts we consider sacred. What would we use to express both of those things if not words?

I also think that people who swear for the effect and then gripe that it should not be considered a big deal are not thinking clearly. If it's not a big deal, then why do you have to swear?

[Moderator]

why do you have to swear


It's cathartic and I've learned to do it when there's the time and the place for it. Just speaking personally, but after stubbing my toe to the point that I'm seeing spots, uttering a "golly, gee, did that hurt" just doesn't express my feelings the same way a "f*ck, f*ck, mother f*ck that hurts!" does. :blush::biggrin2:

[Moderator]

P.S. However, I would not say that (out loud) had I stubbed my toe in public. Time and place, you know. :wink2:

[Todash]

It's cathartic and I've learned to do it when there's the time and the place for it. Just speaking personally, but after stubbing my toe to the point that I'm seeing spots, uttering a "golly, gee, did that hurt" just doesn't express my feelings the same way a "f*ck, f*ck, mother f*ck that hurts!" does. :blush::biggrin2:
My point exactly!! Those words ARE different from other words. They just ARE.

Also ... I know right? :biggrin2: Just 'cause I don't like swearing doesn't mean I never do it.

[kingricefan]

It's cathartic and I've learned to do it when there's the time and the place for it. Just speaking personally, but after stubbing my toe to the point that I'm seeing spots, uttering a "golly, gee, did that hurt" just doesn't express my feelings the same way a "f*ck, f*ck, mother f*ck that hurts!" does. :blush::biggrin2:

:rofl:

[Shasta]

P.S. However, I would not say that (out loud) had I stubbed my toe in public. Time and place, you know. :wink2:

I couldn't agree with you guys more. I used to have the mouth of a Marine (having grown up with one) and I would cuss all of the time with the mentality that they are just words. It's the one thing my husband really hated that I do. Well, as I get older I seem to like it less and less in public. Yes, they are just words. But I will go out to lunch with my boss and my coworker on a fairly regular basis and they cuss up a storm. It's really rather tacky. I don't want to be tacky!

But I DO love a good motherf*ck when it's needed!

[kingricefan]

I couldn't agree with you guys more. I used to have the mouth of a Marine (having grown up with one) and I would cuss all of the time with the mentality that they are just words. It's the one thing my husband really hated that I do. Well, as I get older I seem to like it less and less in public. Yes, they are just words. But I will go out to lunch with my boss and my coworker on a fairly regular basis and they cuss up a storm. It's really rather tacky. I don't want to be tacky!

But I DO love a good motherf*ck when it's needed!

There is a wonderful scene in the movie 'Dog Fight', between River Phoenix and Lily Taylor that is absolutely hilarious/adorable, when they are out on a 'date' and he been cussing up a storm. She doesn't 'truck' with that, at all!

[GNTLGNT]

P.S. However, I would not say that (out loud) had I stubbed my toe in public. Time and place, you know. :wink2:

...Really?...good tip...next time I bonk my meoln goin' into a business's doorway...I'll give that a shot...:biggrin2: