What Is IT? Caution - Spoilers.

[Fidget]

Okay so this thread may have been done but I've done a couple of searches and I haven't found any topic like this which is strange! Mods feel free to kick my butt if I'm wrong!

IT has always been my favourite SK story, because it was the very first SK novel I read and it got me hooked, but I've always wondered exactly what IT is and I'm sure I'm not the only one so I thought I would start this thread so everybody could put their own theories forward.
I always thought of IT as being part of a race of higher beings, that race being opposite to the race of The White. I.E The Turtle. Pennywise is a shape-shifting vampire that feeds off of emotions, the same as Dandelo in DT and Ardelia Lortz in The Library Policeman. (I'm racking my brains trying to think of others right now but unfortunately my SK collection is back at my Mum's house at the moment!) The very fact that Pennywise is a female and reproduces (or at least tries to) surely shows that IT is part of a race and not a 'one-off'. Also, the closest association the human mind can make with her truest form is insectile, much like Ardelia and Dandelo. I would speculate that the Crimson King is the leader of this race, as his truest form is seen as a spider, the same as his son Mordred. (I can't for the life of me remember where the quote backing this up came from, but I know I've seen it and I'll have to just go through all my books when I get back to Mum's and find it!)

Okay, so there's my theory. Any thoughts?

[bluesology]

I think your suggestion is certainly possible. I definitely think you are on the right track connecting different books together in this way. My personal opinion is that IT was a creature that was left behind in the beginning of time when the Prim receded. My theory regarding Dandelo is that he was one of IT's offspring - one that managed to escape from Ben's bootheel.

[dsurrett]

Maybe I'd be wrong, but I'd bet that Mr. King didn't know exactly what Pennywise was as he wrote book, but that the creature grew and evolved as the story did.

[Robert Gray]

While these suppositions all have a certain internal logic, they overlook several things. The first (and most important) fact is we get a direct look into the mind of It within the book itself. The God/Demon/Monster clearly considers itself unique and one of only two entities of roughly similar nature. It has a sneaking suspicion that there might be an "Other" but that is irrelevant to this discussion. There is a powerful dichotomy in the novel, wherein beings very small on the cosmic scale (human children) vie with an entity so vast an ancient that it existed somewhere in the void before the Earth even started spinning. In that context, debates about the Crimson King and other spider-like beings of far lesser power are kind of Moot.

Consider the Crimson King. This being lusts for power and control. He intends to bring down reality and master it, for all intents and purposes to do the same thing that Roland intends (climb to the top of the Tower), albeit for different reasons. This entity is a manipulator, a planner. He plots and schemes. It, by stark contrast, has no interest in such things. The monster enjoys feeding and sleeping. It doesn't plot to control the universe. It already believes it is master of all things and as such is largely above them. The realization that it isn't the only being of vast cosmic power (besides the impotent turtle) upsets It greatly. The novel seems to imply that It is the Deadlights. The immortal part of It remains forever spinning and glittering out there in the void, utterly alien. Only as it worms its way into the world can it take more solid, specific form.

I would suggest (as I do not claim to know all) that the barrier beyond which the Deadlights blaze has cracks and holes. These fissures aren't big enough for the Deadlights (It) to come forth, but are just large enough to allow part of It (far reduced in power) to slip into the world to amuse itself.

[CarrieJo]

I honestly never connected any of these. But you have my wheels turning and I think you have a very good point about Dandelo and Ardelia Lortz. I will ponder.

[GNTLGNT]

Yah, it was something the Prim coughed up...

[Silhouette86]

Some things are creepier when you don't know, I beleive. Maybe everything that is intended to scare you.

[omm poppa mow mow]

you covered all the bases, Fidget! The only thing left is to go play in right field... and I think that It is like the Obama-meister....or maybe..and yeah, this is scairy, maybe It is like Maybell, next door. You have no lived until you are sweating in your long johns on the garage roof and the neighbor lady, Maybell, is doing the sister-act next door, shaking her fist at you, and George, you remember George, right? George comes out and tells you, "you'll never work in this town again."

Heh.

oh fock me running.

have you read Under the Dome, as yet? If not, a reading is in order. It, was also the 1s I ever read from the bard-miester from Maine.

We need more shee-ite like that, like what he writes. There's not enough out there, for truly.

Here's one back atcha...what was the green man, from Insomnia...good? bad? otherwise? you figure out that one as yet?

[Carlos Solrac]

IT is the deadlights, a destructive light that can manifest itself into whatever it reads in the human mind. (which is why the symbol on the door manifested as different things to the loser's club) IT came in the prehistorian era and murdered off the settlers of Derry (like roanoke but without Legion). IT is harder to kill than anything, so its heart getting ripped out may not have killed him but rebirthed him into this world, which explains his appearances in INSOMNIA, THE TOMMYKNOCKERS, DREAMCATCHER, etc. IT is all you fear and nothing at all. i hope this answered your question.

[Elemeno P]

Is Tak considered in the same league?

[Carlos Solrac]

Tak is nothing like it. Tak can not manifest itself into fear, it can possess people and take over.

[Fidget]

Wow, some really good theories here! I'm glad I've got people talking!

Robert Gray, your post really got me thinking. While IT doesn't strive FOR power, it does enjoy it's power over human beings, taking life from them to sustain itself and controlling their emotions. Could it not be possible that ALL these creatures are greater or lesser 'off-shoots' of the Deadlights, escaping through the cracks? But due to the Deadlights' fractured consciousness they are unaware of each other? IT may very well just have a God-complex, or be the only one of it's kind in that world. As in the SK universe we know there's more than one world and the Todash darkness in between them, which could be the same thing as the Deadlights, who knows?

Elemeno P: Yeah I would consider Tak as being connected to the other in some way. Though I have to admit Desperation and The Regulators are books I've only read once, so I can't really remember them very well! (I've read IT about twenty-odd times!)

Silhouette: I believe that too, but in this case, the thought that there could be countless more entities like IT out there somewhere is a lot scarier!

I dunno, maybe I'm just one of those people that overthinks things, haha!

[GNTLGNT]

Is Tak considered in the same league?

Maybe the "farm club", but not the major league level...powerful, but not quite as full of cussedness...

[Elemeno P]

Maybe the "farm club", but not the major league level...powerful, but not quite as full of cussedness...

Ah....i c

Guess he couldn't hit the curve ball and was left playing in the "sand". :laugh:

[Ward]

IT is one of the greater Demon Elemental of The Beam (The Outer Dark's opposition to the Guardian of The Beam) - hence IT very close relationship with The Turtle. In DT6 Mia said that for each guardian there's a rival/demon counterpart to them - IT is obviously the Turtle's rival. Remember, IT reside in the Macroverse - basically the very end of the Beam and where the beam Guardians reside as well

I think it is obvious that IT isn't just some random monster/demon/ghost, but an extremely powerful being of pure evil. So much that Gan view IT as a threat and guide The Loser to destroy IT. I mean, The Loser need both the Turtle AND Gan help in order to get rid of IT - this show us just how powerful IT is :smile2:

With the Turtle being the most powerful Beam's Guardian, I think IT could very well be the most power Demon Elemental.

[Alexandra19]

Hi !

Great thread and interesting ideas !
Like it's been said before, I also believe that Stephen King didn't necesseraly have a clear idea what IT was when he started writing the book. It sure belonged to Derry, there was the Turtle just like in the Dark Tower but I'm not sure he thought about all the connexions we are not able to make thanks to books like Insomnia, The Tommyknockers, Dreamcatcher and Under The Dome.
If we linked them all, though, I think we can assume IT is a pentachrone, probably belonging to the same race as the Crimson King (I've been wondering for a while if It and the Crimson King couldn't be the same entity because of the huge similarites between them that are described in Insomnia - in fact, I even wondered if It, The Crimson King and the creature in Rose Madder (crimson dress, giant spider inside) couldn't be just one but I don't think it works, or one of the Bull Guardians would have been a bull).
I'm finally thinking IT lives on its own ; it actually reminds me of the Lovecraft creatures living in the Otherworld. It shouldn't have landed in Derry, but as it has (and as the losers see it), it finally managed to belong there, divided in 2 parts : the deadlights and whatever face it has to make to have an access to our world and feed (which also allows the losers to destroy it).

Ward, I find your theory really interesting and it makes me ask myself one big question : I remember what Mia said about the rival counterpart for each guardian, but I thought these rivals were guardians themselves... So to my mind, the Turtle's opposite was Shardik, who is at the opposite of the same Beam (I picture the whole thing as one good guardian and one evil one at each part of a same beam). Am I totally wrong ? :-s

[Ward]

Hi !
Ward, I find your theory really interesting and it makes me ask myself one big question : I remember what Mia said about the rival counterpart for each guardian, but I thought these rivals were guardians themselves... So to my mind, the Turtle's opposite was Shardik, who is at the opposite of the same Beam (I picture the whole thing as one good guardian and one evil one at each part of a same beam). Am I totally wrong ? :-s

No, all of the Beam's 12 guardians are good and serve the White. However, each one of those guardians most likely have their own exclusive Demon Elemental rival/enemy - with IT being the Turtle's rival/enemy.

There are 12 guardians and 6 Demon Elementals but each one of those Demon Element has 2 aspect (male and female) 2 x 6 = 12. So in all there are 12 Demon Elementals as well.

The Maerlyn's Rainbow - created by the evil wizard Maerlyn to bring chaos into the world - are suppose to represent each one of those Demon Elementals.

Crimson
Orange
Yellow
Pink
Dark Blue
Dark Green
Indigo
Lime
Azure
Violet
Brown
Pearl Grey
Black (this one represent The Dark Tower)

The Orange one is obvious IT since the deadlight itself is Orange :smile2:

Anyway, that's my view and analysis. I could be wrong. Maybe an expert could chime in and give us more infos. We all would love to know more about IT and Its origin :grinning:

[Sanguise]

If It is the famale aspect of a Greater Demon elemental whats ITs male side....Hmmmm

[Gazou]

Hello! First post here. I am reading It just now for the 5th time (or 6th, I don't know)

I think It’s just pure evil and people’s mind have made It what it is now. The deadlights are immortal, but Its material incarnation has powers and weaknesses defined by what people believe. I think where it really lives is in our minds.

Is it really female? Audra exclaims that it’s a female because It has eggs, but that’s also just the way a mortal perceives It. If it’s a primordial power I think it does not have a sex.

It is powerfull, but it's scope is very limited in our world. Why would such a powerful entity limit itself to a small city? Its eggs may be extra “holes” in the "wall" from which It could invade our worlds and spread itself.

I don’t think its children are “other” monsters. I don't feel any relation between It and the CK. But there's a line somewhere in the book like "Father and son sometime have only a passing resemblance and often different tastes" so anything is possible.

I don’t think there is a connection between Dandelo and It either. Dandelo feeds purely on emotions themselves, even laughter. Laughter is poison to It and It feed on the flesh of it’s victim. The fear is just a spice. I would see more a connection between Dandelo and the creature in the library policeman novel.

In general I like how Kings stories connect together, but in the case of It, its more a stand-alone for me. I dont like to compare it to anything else. Its just IT!

I find the story has more in common with the world of HP Lovecraft then with the Dark Tower. The deadlights remind me of the god Azathot, the ultimate chaos at the center of all things. The coming of It is very reminescent of the short story The Colour out of Space. In that story an alien power comes by some meteorite and “lives” inside a well, where it sucks out the life-force of everything around.

[Mr. Jabot]

The following is everything I know about IT, according the information in the book in other books. I know this is an old thread, but I'm looking for possibly more insight since I'm collecting all I can about the monster as well as the Turtle. Thankfully there's numerous information on the Turtle, but sadly there isn't a whole lot about IT as only one novel was dedicated to it. I'd also like to mention that if I missed anything or anything is wrong here, please let me know and I'll change/add it right away! I also apologize for explaining the DT/etc, this was originally intended for people who never read SK books.


IT is a powerful female glamour. IT was created, probably indirectly, by Gan, as opposition to the Turtle. IT represents many things: first and foremost, it is a glamour so powerful that it has reached the status of a deity and exists as the chaos and malevolence to Maturin (the Turtle’s) order and kindness. It is a single-minded creature, and its true form is an endless wall of colorful, insane light that exists outside of the universe, in the Macroverse. Viewing its true form causes mortals to be pulled into the Deadlights (its true form/eyes) and induces insanity. IT was born from the darkness of todash or the Prim, the space in between dimensions that houses very powerful, very deadly demons and monsters. IT’s physical form arrived on Earth in a meteor. On Earth it discovered that the human imagination made the taste of their flesh very rich: because of this, and because of its near-deity status, humans which view IT see it as their greatest fear reflected back at them. This also means that IT represents the Boogeyman, or childhood fear in general – it prefers to prey on children since their fears are more tangible, and in doing this it becomes a representation of the monster “under the bed” or “in the closet-“ a monster that every child fears but few have names for. IT wakes up to feed every 30 years, between which it hibernates. This 30 year period represents the shift from childhood to adulthood. Each time IT awakes and sleeps, it causes a catastrophic event to occur in Derry, representing the awakening or hibernation: The Ironworks exploded, a fire happened at a local restaurant, a gunfight, etc. IT, as far as is known, acknowledges no other cosmic beings besides itself and the Turtle, the creature who created the Earth. While in the Macroverse, IT looks only in one direction: towards the Earth, and thus sees nothing of the rest of the Macroverse. IT does not become aware of the Other, or Gan, until near the end of the novel. IT’s physical form, the shapeshifter, lives on Earth, while IT’s true form resides outside of our dimension. The form it chooses to take the most often is that of a clown named Pennywise; whose real name is supposedly Bob Gray. Pennywise is intended to provide its victims with a false sense of security; first creating an aura of friendliness before moving in for the final kill. IT appears to have developed a sense of humor in its time on Earth, as it will often joke with and laugh at its victims when they are proving to be more difficult to handle than its usual fair. IT will often leave messages, notes, or drawings that are threatening to the individual that IT intends to hunt. IT possibly influenced the creation of Derry, and IT also represents the spirit of the town – it is a dead town with a maze of sewers beneath it, a town where the murders and unfortunate happenstances generally tend to go unnoticed, thanks to IT. IT and Derry seem to share a symbiotic relationship: It is unknown whether one can exist without the other, one of the many reasons why many people tend to dislike Derry but don’t particularly know the reason for the dislike. IT must abide by the rules of the physical form that it chooses to take. For example, when in the form of a werewolf, silver is known to be particularly harmful to it. IT is also known to influence the behavior of the citizens of Derry, making them both dismissive and occasionally ill-willed. In the Stephen King universe, the Dark Tower is the physical form of Gan, or God. The Dark Tower is held up and protected by beams, and these beams are guarded by animals Gods. One of these animal Gods is the Turtle, Maturin. While these beams hold up and protect the universe, there are beams on the outside of the universe that pull in the opposite direction, seeking to topple the Dark Tower and cause chaos. These beams are guarded by demonic guardians and are possibly represented by various colors of the rainbow. It is a common theory among Stephen King fans that IT represents the opposition to the Turtle’s beam: that it is the demon that guards the beam opposite to the Turtle (possibly the orange beam). This is further supported by the fact that IT actually mentions the Beam in IT. There is another creature in the Stephen King universe that is the same, or a very similar species, to IT. His name was Dandelo, and unlike IT, he was a creature who fed off of the emotion of laughter instead of fear. He, however, is much less powerful than IT and is more bound to his physical nature. He has a robot named Stuttering Bill.

[gilligan421]

how can you be confused it is a creature opposite the turtle, who where both prob created by "the other". it originaly came from outside the universe (presumably kept out side because it would eat the turtle). a commit must have hit the wall at the edge of existance and pulled some of "it" from the other side and eventualy landed in pre historic deary, where it made its home.

[TheTurtle]

which explains his appearances in INSOMNIA, THE TOMMYKNOCKERS, DREAMCATCHER, etc.

I have read Dreamcatcher serveral times, Tommyknockers once, and I have not read Insomnia. I have read IT 12+ times. I have also seen many posts where people draw connections of the creature in IT to characters from the DT series and those have all been really helpful, but also the way Robert puts it makes a whole lot of since (I'm favoring his explanation now).

However, I wish to know about the connection with these other three books? Just to give me more to ponder on!

[whiteyfats]

I have read Dreamcatcher serveral times, Tommyknockers once, and I have not read Insomnia. I have read IT 12+ times. I have also seen many posts where people draw connections of the creature in IT to characters from the DT series and those have all been really helpful, but also the way Robert puts it makes a whole lot of since (I'm favoring his explanation now).

However, I wish to know about the connection with these other three books? Just to give me more to ponder on!

Dreamcatcher: one of the characters sees the memorial the Loser's Club set up, and something had wrote "Pennywise lives!" on it.

Tommyknockers" One of the characters glances a clown in the sewers

can't remember the one from Insomnia.